Instead of asking, ‘How can I make the most amount of money?’ you ask ‘How can I help the most amount of people?’. The money you make online is directly proportional to the people you help.
Quick note: I recently launched a new blog on how to make money with your email list. Check it out.
Did you recently launch a new blog and wondering how you are going to make money with it?
There’s little to no information on Google about making money from a new blog.
When I searched the phrase “how to make money with a new blog”, I literally came up with just 1 or 2 decent articles. All the other links are either pointing to how to start a WordPress blog or some junk.
That means, most bloggers either don’t know how to make money with a brand new blog or they simply didn’t like the complexity of the topic. Anyway, I decided to write an ultimate guide about the topic so it can be especially helpful for the beginner bloggers.
In this detailed guide, you’re not going to find mediocre points like make money with affiliate marketing, sell banner ads, publish paid reviews etc as new blogs don’t generate money that way! You’ll only discover the PRACTICAL ways to make money with a brand NEW blog.
Are you curious? Let’s jump in.
How I made money with a new blog?
Before diving into the details, let’s quickly talk about how this blog made money when it’s new. The blog that you’re currently reading now was launched in 2012. It’s been over 5 years.
Here’s how I made money with it when it’s new.
- Within 2 months of starting my blog, I offered services (ranging from SEO to content marketing to blog management) by creating a dedicated landing page. Initially I worked only with a couple of clients, later focused on working with 1 or 2 big clients at any given time (to make more money by giving more value).
- You might ask “how did you get the initial traction to get first clients?”. I left 30 to 50 thoughtful comments on other sites that are relevant to my blog topics. This helped me bring new visitors from other sites. Regular blog commenting helped me build connections with other bloggers. That lead me to write guest posts for them and build my email list. Then, I used a combination of my blog posts + email sequence to land my first few clients.
I know it sounds really simple. But it’s not.
So why am I sharing those details?
To give you an idea about how it works. You don’t make money from a new blog without bringing new visitors to your sites. Blog commenting and guest posting worked well for me to get initial traction and first few customers. Then, I used email marketing, SEO, content marketing etc to attract high paying clients.
Quick note: Over the past 5 years of my full-time blogging experience, I’ve experimented with a lot of new blogs run by others. Sometimes we failed. Sometimes we made money. But there are a few PROVEN money making strategies I learned. You’re going to find exactly those strategies in this guide.
The conventional way to make money blogging
Here’s how 99% of the bloggers make money from their sites.
- Create content
- Increase traffic
- Make money (AdSense, affiliate marketing, product reviews, ads etc)
- Brag about it on Facebook
There’s a problem with the traditional way of making money blogging.
It takes HUGE time.
- Creating content is not easy. It takes time.
- Driving visitors from Google to your sites takes time.
- Finding the RIGHT ways to monetize your blog takes trial and error.
In the best case scenario, it takes at least 6 months to really start getting traffic to your sites. And you can’t monetize until then if you follow the conventional way.
Even then, no one can guarantee that you will make money from your blog.
5 Tried And Tested Ways to Make Money With A New Blog In 2017
Did you know that 81% of bloggers never make $100 from blogging?
Then, what’s the best approach to make money with a brand new blog?
There’s no “one size fits all” approach in blogging. There are NO rules. There are people who NEVER make money even after an year of blogging and there are some smart nerds who make money even before they launch their sites.
If you are a beginner, I suggest you to monetize your blog from day 1. I’m saying it from my 5 years of full-time blogging experience. If you don’t have a clue about how to make money from a new blog when you are starting out, you’ll go through difficult times later.
That being said, here are few PRACTICAL ways to make money from a new blog or website.
#1. Collect emails even before the launch
Most people start a WordPress site with ZERO audience.
In fact, when I launched this blog back in 2012, I too did the same mistake. But I didn’t know that launching a WordPress blog with no audience can take a lot of time (several months) to make it profitable.
If you’ve recently started a blog, make sure to focus on building your email list. If you’re planning to launch a new blog, it’s better to collect emails even before the launch.
Here are few benefits of building an email list even before the launch.
- When you publish your first blog post, you will have audience to read, share and comment on it.
- Other than your cat, grandma – there will be a few people to give you some feedback about your blog. Trust me, getting initial feedback helps A LOT.
- You can find out your target audience. That means, you can create the RIGHT content strategy right off the bat.
Blogs like Smart Blogger and Neil Patel didn’t get big because they posted a lot of content. They got bigger because they collected a TON of email subscribers even before the launch.
Jon Morrow’s Smart Blogger has gotten over 13,000 email subscribers before even writing the first post.
It’s no wonder that his blog now makes over $100K per month. Jon had a strategy. Jon Knew what he was doing. He deliberately collected a TON of emails before the launch.
How to collect emails before the launch?
Simply put up a “coming soon” page with an email opt-in box and an incentive offer.
Let’s break that down into 3 points. You need 3 things to get an audience before write even a word.
- A coming soon page
- An email opt-in form
- An incentive (eBook, webinar, podcast, Infographic etc)
Let’s now talk about them in detail so you can get hundreds of people reading your site when you launch it.
#1. How to create a stellar coming soon page?
You can use this plugin to create beautiful coming soon pages for your site to collect emails even before the launch. The plugin is free and easy to use.
#2. How to put an email opt-in form?
Use free services like MailChimp (when you’re starting out). If you are really serious about making money from a new blog right off the bat, choose a better service like GetResponse, ConvertKit etc. They make your life easier by giving access to landing pages, email templates, A/B testing etc. Create an opt-in form, grab the code and paste it on your coming soon page by including a free eBook/video/tool for your audience.
#3. How to create an incentive that your audience can’t resist to grab it?
An incentive (freebie) is what attracts normal blog visitors to enter their email to join your email list. So make sure to spend extra time on it to craft a great one. Here’s a useful tutorial on creating a magnetic incentive.
#2. Get your first 3 customers
In my early days of blogging, I was always asking myself one question: “how do I get paying clients?”.
As I said earlier in the article, I monetized this blog by offering services. I didn’t get paying clients from day 1. Honestly, I had no clue how to proceed further.
I started getting more and more clients when I focused on churning out more useful content for my blog. If I had to do it again, I would first focus on getting 3 customers.
You don’t need 100. You don’t need 10. Just focus on getting your first 3 customers and you are all set.
Noah Kagan from AppSumo has an amazing case study blog called “How I Got My First 3 Customers” where you will discover the stories of how entrepreneurs started their own businesses and the steps for you to do the same.
You will find a TON of bloggers from various niches sharing their stories on how they got their first 3 paying customers.
Go through the site, read a couple of stories and you will get a ton of ideas on how to get your first few paying clients. That being said, here are few more practical tips on how to do that.
Implement “Free to Three” approach
This strategy was coined by digital marketer, Rob Pene who used it to get his first few paying clients.
Rob Pene asked 3 of his friends, who he knew had a business but no website. He approached them about creating their website to add to his portfolio, in exchange for a referral.
After completing the first 3 sites, Rob simultaneously launched a promotional effort using these three sites as his showcase portfolio, and asked each of his friends to send their friends to his promotional landing page.
The promotion ran for a few days and along with the referrals from his friends and within his first month of business, he landed he first 30 paying clients.
Work for free in the beginning
This is one of the smart strategies majority of the people use.
Work for free or offer your services at free of charge when you are just starting out.
Why? The reason is simple. When you are new, you don’t need new clients. You need social proof. You need testimonials. You need trust. You need authority.
When you offer free services to others, getting all of them will be really easy. Do exceptional job at free of cost and when the job is done, simply ask for a referral or testimonial. Showcase them in your services page and keep on doing it until you get your first few clients.
#3. Fill this: “How would [your favorite blogger] do it?”
How would Tim Ferriss make money from a brand new blog?
How would Ramit Sethi make money even before the launch?
These are the questions I asked myself many times while launching sites for my clients. And guess what? These questions take your thinking to the NEXT level. By answering them, you will get access to creative thoughts.
This particular question helps you find few more things like;
- What specific monetization models others are using?
- What traffic strategies they are using?
- How they are turning their audience into customers?
- What’s their content length, posting frequency and SEO strategies?
- Who are linking to their sites and what products they are promoting?
By carefully analyzing the competitor’s in your industry, you will get a TON of ideas on how to make money with a new blog in 2017 and beyond.
So what are you waiting for? Just open a notepad and start writing notes by analyzing your competitor’s sites.
#4. Ready. Fire. Aim
If you want to make money blogging quickly, you simply need to take action first and make any necessary adjustments and correct for any mistakes later on.
Use “Ready, fire, aim” concept to make money with a new blog. Here’s the breakdown of it into 3 phases.
Phase 1: Ready
This is the research stage where you need to know your target.
If you bought a SEO course, “Ready” phase means absorbing all the information including the SEO basics. Knowing all the ins and outs of what’s needed to make money with your new blog.
Just don’t focus on 100% understanding the things. Don’t spend too much time researching the stuff.
The key here is knowing your target and failing quickly!
Phase 2: Fire
Remember the 80/20 rule. Just take action.
Even if you don’t hit the bullseye, you still hit the target.
Taking an action and failing at it is way better than not taking any action.
Phase 3: Aim
Now that you’ve taken action, you can gradually fix any mistakes you’ve made in the beginning.
You’re already way ahead of the guy who’s still reading the SEO basics (instead of actually implementing them), so pat yourself on the back.
Now, based on the new information, set new goals. Rinse and repeat the process. That’s how you make money with a new blog.
Set a target. Take immediate action. Learn from mistakes. Make money!
#5. Offer services to money making bloggers
One of the fastest ways to make money from a new blog is to offer services. That’s how I made money when I started this blog. But things have changed now.
I figured out a couple of creative ways that you can use to make money by offering services through your sites. Here are 2 highly effective strategies just for you.
Quick note: I’m coining my own terms for these 2 strategies, so if they sound weird don’t blame me.
Strategy 1: The Idea Mix Technique
Step 1: Create a list of bloggers who make money
Create a spreadsheet, make a list of 50 to 100 bloggers from various industries (fitness, travelling, finance, marketing etc) who make money from their sites.
So how do you build such list?
Use the following search strings on Google.
“Niche” + “top blogs”
For instance: you could search;
“Fitness” + “top blogs”
“Marketing” + “money making blogs”
“Finance” + top bloggers
Keep an eye on those links that create massive lists something like “top 50 bloggers in fitness industry” so you can easily create a huge list that can be helpful for you to pitch your services.
Step 2: Come up with 10 ideas to help each blogger
Instead of directly pitching your services, find a way to quickly build a connection with other bloggers so that you can improve the odds of working with them.
How can you quickly build rapport with other bloggers?
I’ve a simple tip for you which I’m borrowing from James Altucher.
Come up with 10 ideas.
Send those 10 ideas to each and every blogger in your list.
You could come up with anything like;
- 10 ideas to improve others site
- 10 ideas to help other bloggers make more money
- 10 ideas to boost others traffic, sales, subscribers etc
The idea here is to focus on them. Focus on how you can offer immense value to others with your ideas. You can find more about it from here.
Step 3: Pitch them up!
Once you get responses from other bloggers (expect at least 3 responses out of 20), pitch them your services. Tell them that you are offering a similar service that either saves their time or money.
Strategy 2: The Bryan Harris Technique
Yea, you guessed it right. This strategy was first introduced to me by Bryan Harris from Videofruit. I especially love this one because it is really simple yet highly effective to make money by offering services.
Step 1: Find an in-depth “how-to” article
Read top blogs in your industry. You will find a TON of how-to guides that are usually in-depth, highly informative and useful.
Either you can look for each blog’s popular posts or use Buzzsumo to find top performing content on any site.
Go and read that post. Now you have more knowledge than 90% of the rest.
For instance, you’re in a fitness industry and you have figured out a case study around increasing rankings of a website on Google in 3 months. Read that case study thoroughly, make some notes and dig into further to get some knowledge.
Now, you can use it a service.
Step 2: Offer it as a service
Enter the URL of the in-depth article either on Buzzsumo or Twitter search and you can find people who shared the post.
Find their email address, pitch them your service. If you don’t get a response, keep on doing it.
As a rule of thumb, make sure to reach out to 10 to 20 people every day. Just don’t wait for their responses. Keep doing it. You will get paying clients with hustle.
How to find email addresses of others?
For all of the above strategies to work, you need an email address to contact and pitch your services. This is the most trickiest part but I’ll make it easy for you.
Here are few proven ways to find email addresses of others.
- Most bloggers use “contact” pages on their sites. Email them through their contact forms. Many of them also include their working email address on their contact or about us pages.
- If you’re failed with the above step, subscribe to their email newsletter. Almost every single top blogger or marketer has an email list. Subscribe and hit reply to their welcome email.
- Use twitter. Contact the person and ask them to DM their email address.
- If nothing works, use hunter.io. It’s a terrific tool (they also have a browser extension) to find working emails of any website in the world. I’m using it and it works like a charm.
Here are few more essential things to spice up your game
Build a portfolio: Your portfolio is where you can flaunt all your best work.
- Include links to your guest posts
- Mention if you have got featured on top sites, brands etc
- Showcase your previous work
Having a portfolio page specially designed for your services attracts more customers. The people who are in a decision stage will buy from you if they are satisfied with your previous work. So give top priority to creating a portfolio for all the services you offer.
Use social proof: People are herd animals. We follow crowds. If 100 people are rushing to buy something, we automatically check what’s happening. That’s called “herd mentality” in short.
If you use testimonials, reviews or expert quotes – they work like a charm and increase your conversion rates.
Write guest posts: Matt Cutts said guest blogging is dead. Yes, it’s dead if you are doing it solely for link building. On the other hand, guest posting is the fastest way for relationship building.
If you focus on building a network using guest posts, getting links, traffic and sales won’t be hard. Land on top blogs with your guest posts until you get a momentum with your blog.
Conclusion on making money with a new blog in 2017
Making money with a new blog isn’t difficult if you think outside of the box.
If you follow the same old fashioned way (“create content, build audience, sell stuff blah blah”), it takes months if not years to make money.
That’s why I gave my best advice for you to quickly make money with a brand new blog in 2017 and beyond. So what do you think about this mega 3000+ word post?
Is it helpful? Do you have a new blog or planning to launch new one? Do you need any advice? Let me know in the comments or mail me at rahul@learnblogtips.com and I’ll try my best to respond to every email.
Excellent stuff, Rahul!
In the long term, it’s all about building relationships with others instead of bringing more visitors from search engines.. the more you focus on people the faster you can make money!
I also learnt one thing while making money online: it requires persistence.
You can’t get results overnight. You need to work extra hard and you need a monetization plan from the beginning as you said.
Thanks for coming back with your rocking stuff!
Signing off..
Hi Elnaseh,
Relationships lead to more exposure. More blog exposure leads to more sales. Simple as that.
After all, it’s the people that pay you. So focus on building loyal audience from day 1 and also figure out ways to make money right off the bat instead of waiting for an year or two.
Thanks for stopping by!
Making money from a new blog is hard when you have zero audience.
You need blogging routines. Routines are essential to keep you on track. If you want to build a profitable blog, you need to be consistent.
Analyse your competition, focus on people, build an email list from day 1 and you will find a ton of ways to make money!
Thanks for enlightening us with the article. Just tweeted!
Hi Claire,
So true. Thanks for the retweet.
Making money from a new blog is hard when you have zero selling skills. SO make sure to focus on how to sell your stuff without sounding like a sales guy. The best way to make money from a blog is to help as many people as you can.
Thanks for stopping by!
Hi Rahul,
Great tips. I especially liked that you didn’t mention most common monetization strategies like affiliate marketing, adsense and all (they really don’t help new sites to generate money).
I also liked the tip that offering services from day 1. If you are building a business online, you need to find ways to make money.
Without that focus, it’s impossible to continue for a long time here. New bloggers should remember one thing, focus on offering help to other bloggers who are already making money.
Who knows? They may help you one day by hiring to do their work for them. So help others before seeking help.
Hi Rahul,
There is no doubt that you have nailed the topic. Most of the newbies might guess that you are going to reveal some blog monetization strategies like Affiliate Marketing, Adsense, Paid Reviews etc, but you have crafted the post in a smart way with the essential details.
I 100% agree with your viewpoints and yes, if we help the people, we can make money. Good to know that the blog commenting and guest blogging worked well for you and helped you get new clients.
Your idea of offering the services is really good and thanks for sharing the methods that you have experimented and executed. I hope it would help the upcoming bloggers to get a crystal clear view of earning income with a blog.
Thanks for adding the helpful links and examples. I always admire your awesome work and scripting skill. Keep your good work.
Hi Nirmala,
Always believed “if you’ve NOTHING useful to say”, don’t say anything at all! Maybe that’s the reason why I was skeptical about writing new blog posts around blogging on this blog for a long time.
But there are a ton of people like you (and I tell you, I really like the aura that you spread around blogoshpere) wanted me to write more. So here I’m.
Glad you found the post useful and keep up the great work with your new projects.
Great Post Dear Rahul!
I got some Lime light.
Since, I’m a Beginner, I always Read Awsome Stuffs like this. But unable find a way to keep a note of them.
I request, Please suggest a better way to keep a note of the Points from Great articles similar to this !
Sure thing buddy!
Email me at rahul@learnblogtips.com if you’ve any questions whatsoever related to blogging, SEO..
Stay connected.
Hello Rahul,
Its been a long time to visit your blog. I think you have shared a extremely useful article. Most of the people are worried about their new blogs monetization.
I think this post is really useful to learn making money with new blogs.
Thanks
Hi bro,
It’s been a long time since I posted something on the blog.. true that. Around 1000 days I guess.
But here’s the thing.. I’ll be consistently posting one masterpiece a week from now on :)
Thanks for stopping by to show your support, Raj!
Hi Rahul,
Sensational dude. Rocking post. Because it preaches practical tips for making money based on sound fundamentals. Brilliant.
Most new bloggers’ energy screams “I’m broke!” and they wonder why they cannot make a dime. Or why you saw so few search results for new bloggers to make money. If you can shift from poverty conscious/fear to prosperity conscious/love, you do the things – guest posting and blog commenting and creating helpful content – that lead to the money.
Since I think a little about my blog I do a ton of creating and connecting off site. This is being abundant. Helping others out. Reaching out. Promoting others. Which allows a steady flow of traffic to find me through all my time spent serving others with love, off-site.
Thanks for the inspired share bro.
Ryan
Be abundant in offering value – that’s a great tip, Ryan.
Most beginners ask “what’s in it for me?” when they blog. The right question to ask is “how can I offer help without expecting anything” (at least in the beginning).
That’s how you succeed online.
People like you, Pat, Zac, Derek all are successful because of one thing: they know how to add a TON of value to others.
You always inspire people like me to churn out more content regularly, Ryan. That’s a great attribute you’ve.
Keep rocking.. how’s your stay at Qatar?
Hi Rahul,
If you want to earn money from a blog in ethical ways then it will take a lot of time and you need patience.
I am running my blog without any link building or any other aggressive SEO techniques.
We publish quality content and little bit on Page SEO :)
Good to see you back on track, I hope you will come with more articles in future.
Hi Nishant,
Surprised to see you here, and happy!
Veterans (who started blogging 5 years ago) like us don’t do anything aggressive. Be it SEO, money or traffic generation. We follow “do it steadily and slowly”. That’s what most new comers lack. That’s why the failure rate in blogging is so much high.
I’ll be posting every week from now on bro!
Thanks for stopping by. Keep up the great work, and I love Filmy Keeday.
How’s your Yeh jawani hei deewani waala lifestyle (travelling) going?
Hello Rahul,
Great post, as everyone has commentated here regarding blogging. I’d like say that blogging needs lots of efforts and hard work. The main thing is consistency and finally we can expect good results.
Thanks
Rahul, you have shared some great and useful techniques in this post. I have also started a new blog and seems like I’m gonna need to try these methods to start making money.
Thanks
All the best Vinod. Don’t hesitate to ask any questions you’ve or you can mail me at rahul@learnblogtips.com
Hello Rahul nice post.
Really liked the point that, we should collect emails even before we start publishing posts on the blog. Hard work with determination is the best way to succeed online.
Conventional way of blogging ha limits and it wont give us the benefit we deserves, We should come up with smart ides and then convert those ideas into reality. ideas that have the potential to drive relevant traffic and increase conversion.
Hi Nishant,
Finally, your comment is live now ;)
True, conventional path won’t lead to surefire success. Take the road less travelled, don’t give up and motivate yourself – that’s how succeed in the long run. Just don’t take shortcuts. It’s the surest way to be a failure.
Thanks for stopping by!
Thanks Rahul for sharing this wonderful blog, making money with the blog is amazing think. This is really interesting post you’ve given the boost to the new bloggers.
Incredible stuff bro, I read your other articles also like 1000+ visitor per day. Thanks for writing such a great article. By the way, I want to know how do you write such lengthy content in a neat way.
Awesome post……. your article is really informative and helpful for me and other bloggers too because making money online is not as easy as a cup of tea for any blogger but your article is amazing for newbie. Really you have described everything in descriptive, simply yet effective too. You’ve done a great job with this.
Thanks for stopping by Gaurav.
Do let me know if you need any help with your blog or SEO. I’d be glad to help!
Hi Rahul,
Awesome stuff to read, Great tips discussed to makemoney with brand specially the Strategy 2: The Bryan Harris Technique ,your article will really help me and other bloggers to earn money with our blogs/sites.
Thank your for sharing such an informative article.
Hi Sonali,
Glad you found it. I love Bryan’s advice on making money and he also shares some of the best list building tips to build a profitable blog.
Thanks for stopping by!
I came across your blog while surfing the net looking for ways to improve my newly started blog. I found a treasure chest in your blog posting. Thanks so much for taking the time to share all this valuable information.
Thanks mate for stopping by. Yea, it’s about a month since I posted this article and it is currently ranking at 11th position for the keyword “make money with new blog”.
This is an excellent post for new bloggers. i launched my blog 1 month ago but i am not getting traffic. How i can increase the traffic??
Hi Jack,
I’ve a quick tip for you: do expert roundup posts. Don’t rely upon Google for traffic (at least for 6 months). You need more backlinks to increase search traffic. Until then, you can do things like expert roundup posts, guestographics, email outreach etc to get initial traction.
Email me at rahul@learnblogtips.com whenever you need help.
Wow! Rahul what an enlightening post for newbie bloggers like me..keep it man…waiting for more useful resource from you.
Thanks Arvind :) Glad you find it useful.
Awesome post with full of information. Thanks for sharing. I actually visited few of the money blog to check things myself and they are doing really great!
Starting a new blog is damn easy these days in the world of WordPress. But the difficult part is to build the blog, grow the blog traffic over the period of time following the SEO tactics. One can seriously make money from a blog, if he/she is well aware the target of the blog and how to monetize the blog.
Many thanks for this write up.
Starting a new blog is much more easier these days. But building the blog and generating traffic is is difficult task which require useful SEO techniques. By the way this topic very well.
Hey, Rahul,
Excellent stuff!!
You have shared $1000 valuable post and what killer strategies these are!
As far as I did is only posting audience targetting post and shared those on social media platforms. Also, keeping the connection with pro-bloggers. It is bringing few traffic daily but didn’t try email outreach. I will try to follow some techniques from your post and will let you know the result.
BTW, Thanks a lot and wish you a happy weekend.
Hello Rahul,
You have shared really amazing tactics to earn from a brand new blog.
I agree all the points.
But Still I am confused about traffic to a new blog. You said, before launching a blog, we should collect subscriber to read the very fisrt blog post.
I agree with these 3 points for collecting subscribers.
1. A coming soon page
2. An email opt-in form
3. An incentive (eBook, webinar, podcast, Infographic etc)
But still there is something that I did not get, how to drive people on your new blog’s landing page where you have setup optin form?
Hello Rahul,
You are sharing a great article here with us. I also started with the same way and still don’t have any subscriber yet.
Thank you very much for your help buddy.
Making money with a blog is one of a hardest thing and lot of struggle to this thing. But this guide can make them move to next level for making money. I can utilize these methods for my growth. Thanks a lot for sharing this awesome stuffs, Keep updating such this topics.
Hi Rahul,
Some new tricks I have found in this article like Brian Approach etc. I hope tips you disscussed really working. I am also a blogger. I will try this tips although I have launched my blog a few months ago. By the way, thanks for the awesome article.
Hi Rahul,
Thank you for the longest and detailed information about to make money by blog, this is really helpful for the beginners. every tips you written is really acceptable and i think it will be work effectively and efficiently. well done.
at this time blogging is one of the most trendings in the digital world and all people wants to create there own blog and earn money from it.
you have shared some very good tips for bloggers to earn money from a blog.
I really appreciate your article
Amazingly done! Keep sharing!
Hi Rahul,
Into blogging for years now – the Bryan Harris technique has got few key points. The problem with newbies these days is lack patience and or they focus on too much too early.
This post touches on some areas which should be followed religiously by most of the bloggers. And I agree its still possible to make money by the amateurs – they need to get their first couple of orders and that should be the start –